107 replies to this topic

[surrendersacrifice]

To be a Christian is to follow Christ. To follow Him we must love Him. To love Him is to surrender our life to Him. To surrender our life to Him is to live a life that is His, and not ours. This means that we do and think what He does and thinks. We know that God is always faithful to us although we have been unfaithful to Him, and rejected Him by our sins. Furthermore, He sacrificed His own life so that we may be free of sin and have His life. To be a Christian, therefore, is to do likewise. In addition, since it is God who seals the marriage covenant no one can separate what God has joined together (Matt 19:6); and those who attempt to break this seal go against God. Divorce is therefore, absolutely prohibited for believers (Mk 10:11-12, Luke 16:18; Matthew 5: 31-32); and remarriage after divorce is adultery. Furthermore, a person whose spouse is unfaithful to him/her must stay faithful to his/her spouse just as God is faithful to us even when we reject Him (Hosea 3:1).

God hates divorce (Malachi 2:16) and is not pleased with the offerings of those who divorce their spouse (Malachi 2: 13-14). Jesus tells us that before making offering to God, we must reconcile with those with whom we have grievances (Matt. 5: 23-24). Therefore, a divorced person must first reconcile with his/her spouse before making an offering to the Lord.

[freckle]

surrendersacrifice, on Nov 1 2009, 12:14 PM, said:

To be a Christian is to follow Christ. To follow Him we must love Him. To love Him is to surrender our life to Him. To surrender our life to Him is to live a life that is His, and not ours. This means that we do and think what He does and thinks. We know that God is always faithful to us although we have been unfaithful to Him, and rejected Him by our sins. Furthermore, He sacrificed His own life so that we may be free of sin and have His life. To be a Christian, therefore, is to do likewise. In addition, since it is God who seals the marriage covenant no one can separate what God has joined together (Matt 19:6); and those who attempt to break this seal go against God. Divorce is therefore, absolutely prohibited for believers (Mk 10:11-12, Luke 16:18; Matthew 5: 31-32); and remarriage after divorce is adultery. Furthermore, a person whose spouse is unfaithful to him/her must stay faithful to his/her spouse just as God is faithful to us even when we reject Him (Hosea 3:1).

God hates divorce (Malachi 2:16) and is not pleased with the offerings of those who divorce their spouse (Malachi 2: 13-14). Jesus tells us that before making offering to God, we must reconcile with those with whom we have grievances (Matt. 5: 23-24). Therefore, a divorced person must first reconcile with his/her spouse before making an offering to the Lord.

So are you saying that my mum, who faithfully stayed by my adulterous father for many years until he finally left her and divorced her and married another women, is in the wrong?

Edited by freckle, 01 November 2009 - 05:44 PM.

[Landmark]

surrendersacrifice, on Nov 1 2009, 01:14 PM, said:

To be a Christian is to follow Christ. To follow Him we must love Him. To love Him is to surrender our life to Him. To surrender our life to Him is to live a life that is His, and not ours. This means that we do and think what He does and thinks. We know that God is always faithful to us although we have been unfaithful to Him, and rejected Him by our sins. Furthermore, He sacrificed His own life so that we may be free of sin and have His life. To be a Christian, therefore, is to do likewise. In addition, since it is God who seals the marriage covenant no one can separate what God has joined together (Matt 19:6); and those who attempt to break this seal go against God. Divorce is therefore, absolutely prohibited for believers (Mk 10:11-12, Luke 16:18; Matthew 5: 31-32); and remarriage after divorce is adultery. Furthermore, a person whose spouse is unfaithful to him/her must stay faithful to his/her spouse just as God is faithful to us even when we reject Him (Hosea 3:1).

God hates divorce (Malachi 2:16) and is not pleased with the offerings of those who divorce their spouse (Malachi 2: 13-14). Jesus tells us that before making offering to God, we must reconcile with those with whom we have grievances (Matt. 5: 23-24). Therefore, a divorced person must first reconcile with his/her spouse before making an offering to the Lord.

I believe the booklet linked below by Bro John Carter deals succintly and scripturally with the issues you address.

Divorce and Remarriage

[surrendersacrifice]

freckle, on Nov 1 2009, 06:43 PM, said:

surrendersacrifice, on Nov 1 2009, 12:14 PM, said:

To be a Christian is to follow Christ. To follow Him we must love Him. To love Him is to surrender our life to Him. To surrender our life to Him is to live a life that is His, and not ours. This means that we do and think what He does and thinks. We know that God is always faithful to us although we have been unfaithful to Him, and rejected Him by our sins. Furthermore, He sacrificed His own life so that we may be free of sin and have His life. To be a Christian, therefore, is to do likewise. In addition, since it is God who seals the marriage covenant no one can separate what God has joined together (Matt 19:6); and those who attempt to break this seal go against God. Divorce is therefore, absolutely prohibited for believers (Mk 10:11-12, Luke 16:18; Matthew 5: 31-32); and remarriage after divorce is adultery. Furthermore, a person whose spouse is unfaithful to him/her must stay faithful to his/her spouse just as God is faithful to us even when we reject Him (Hosea 3:1).

God hates divorce (Malachi 2:16) and is not pleased with the offerings of those who divorce their spouse (Malachi 2: 13-14). Jesus tells us that before making offering to God, we must reconcile with those with whom we have grievances (Matt. 5: 23-24). Therefore, a divorced person must first reconcile with his/her spouse before making an offering to the Lord.

So are you saying that my mum, who faithfully stayed by my adulterous father for many years until he finally left her and divorced her and married another women, is in the wrong?

Your mother is not in wrong. On the contrary, she is faithful to God because she stayed faithful to her marriage; even in the face of betrayal.

[freckle]

surrendersacrifice, on Nov 10 2009, 10:31 PM, said:

freckle, on Nov 1 2009, 06:43 PM, said:

surrendersacrifice, on Nov 1 2009, 12:14 PM, said:

Therefore, a divorced person must first reconcile with his/her spouse before making an offering to the Lord.

So are you saying that my mum, who faithfully stayed by my adulterous father for many years until he finally left her and divorced her and married another women, is in the wrong?

Your mother is not in wrong. On the contrary, she is faithful to God because she stayed faithful to her marriage; even in the face of betrayal.

But she's still divorced and cannot be reconciled with her former spouse. Maybe you last sentence should have read "a person who instigates a divorce" instead of " a divorced person"

Edited by freckle, 11 November 2009 - 06:39 PM.

[Evangelion]

I take the view that there is only one unforgiveable sin.

[Colter]

I can say with a fair degree of confidence that when God joins things together, they don't come apart.

It's impossible really for anyone to say which maternal unions would be ordained on high, but clearly there are marriages that should have never happened to begin with.

C

[Gary cook]

I believe GOD has a perfect will and permissive will!

I love GODS perfect will!
You know I had sugar diabetes once very bad 1008 ,i kept passing out ! i stayed 4 days in the hospital after getting out i took 5 shots each day!
I was praying to be healed, but told the Lord ,if it was going to be in HIS permissive will? I do not want healed. I will take these 5 shots the rest of my life time!
Well He did not heal me right away! but after a short time , I was healed 100%

the reason some are not healed is there motives!
You see its different with the world, they only need faith!

WE of course need faith also! But we give ourselves to HIM at salvation and belong to HIM ! Our purpose has to be as unto HIM and for HIS glory and honor!

No longer our purpose , but for HIM!

[Mercia2]

You marry a wife, as we are married to Christ in love. I believe being born into a religion is the worst thing that can happen to anyone. It is like being born into an arranged marriage. You must get divorced to be born again and find the truth. Better to be born into a religion, become atheist or agnostic and then find God again and be truly repentant and born again. Why do Muslims say 'I was born a Muslim'? the mental chains of religion and tradition are all around.

[Mercia2]

Quote

To be a Christian is to follow Christ. To follow Him we must love Him. To love Him is to surrender our life to Him. To surrender our life to Him is to live a life that is His, and not ours. This means that we do and think what He does and thinks. We know that God is always faithful to us although we have been unfaithful to Him, and rejected Him by our sins.

Before I was born again I never dated a modern attractive woman that did not end up being unfaithful to me. It is just the way it is these days especially with good looking women. Ever since I was born again I have been celibate. These are terrible times.

[Mercia2]

Gary cook, on Nov 11 2009, 10:28 PM, said:

I believe GOD has a perfect will and permissive will!

I love GODS perfect will!
You know I had sugar diabetes once very bad 1008 ,i kept passing out ! i stayed 4 days in the hospital after getting out i took 5 shots each day!
I was praying to be healed, but told the Lord ,if it was going to be in HIS permissive will? I do not want healed. I will take these 5 shots the rest of my life time!
Well He did not heal me right away! but after a short time , I was healed 100%

the reason some are not healed is there motives!
You see its different with the world, they only need faith!

WE of course need faith also! But we give ourselves to HIM at salvation and belong to HIM ! Our purpose has to be as unto HIM and for HIS glory and honor!

No longer our purpose , but for HIM!

I think that is true Gary (see bold).
Praise the Lord you were healed!

[Mercia2]

Colter, on Nov 11 2009, 09:40 PM, said:

I can say with a fair degree of confidence that when God joins things together, they don't come apart.

You cannot be married and be truly spiritual as you are always having to cater for fleshly things. It is just not my calling. Not until my work is done God willing. Then of course I would love to get married.

[Gary cook]

Our work never ends even after we die We come back to rule the world !

We all want LOVE and to give LOVE ! it needful in our lives and our purpose
Got to get to work! see ya

[Mercia2]

Gary cook, on Nov 12 2009, 06:01 PM, said:

Our work never ends even after we die We come back to rule the world !

We all want LOVE and to give LOVE ! it needful in our lives and our purpose
Got to get to work! see ya

very true Gary

[surrendersacrifice]

freckle, on Nov 11 2009, 06:38 PM, said:

surrendersacrifice, on Nov 10 2009, 10:31 PM, said:

freckle, on Nov 1 2009, 06:43 PM, said:

surrendersacrifice, on Nov 1 2009, 12:14 PM, said:

Therefore, a divorced person must first reconcile with his/her spouse before making an offering to the Lord.

So are you saying that my mum, who faithfully stayed by my adulterous father for many years until he finally left her and divorced her and married another women, is in the wrong?

Your mother is not in wrong. On the contrary, she is faithful to God because she stayed faithful to her marriage; even in the face of betrayal.

But she's still divorced and cannot be reconciled with her former spouse. Maybe you last sentence should have read "a person who instigates a divorce" instead of " a divorced person"

If she did not divorce him; and does not remarry she is still faithful.

[Landmark]

Evangelion, on Nov 11 2009, 08:17 PM, said:

I take the view that there is only one unforgiveable sin.

quite so, and its not adultery and/or divorce

[Evangelion]

Landmark, on Nov 15 2009, 12:30 PM, said:

Evangelion, on Nov 11 2009, 08:17 PM, said:

I take the view that there is only one unforgiveable sin.

quite so, and its not adultery and/or divorce

Amen.

[Colter]

Mercia2, on Nov 12 2009, 06:47 PM, said:

Colter, on Nov 11 2009, 09:40 PM, said:

I can say with a fair degree of confidence that when God joins things together, they don't come apart.

You cannot be married and be truly spiritual as you are always having to cater for fleshly things. It is just not my calling. Not until my work is done God willing. Then of course I would love to get married.

Mercia2,

God made us male and female for a reason. He gave us 1000 and 1 ways to enjoy life. Human relationships are a fundamental privilege and joy.

Spirituality does not mean becoming miserably prudish fanatics. One can most certainly be committed to a partner and committed to doing Gods will in that relationship and ALL other relationships. It's erroneous to think the two mutually exclusive.

One thing to bear in mind is the commingled requirements of apostleship and discipleship that are a part of the story of Jesus' establishment of the kingdom of heaven 2,000 years ago. Jesus didn't tell the 12 to divorce and abandon their families, his requirement for them was the unflinching commitment of the heart to the business of the kingdom. There could be no divided loyalties when it came to that then, nor can there be any in our faith life now. The 12 were a unique situtation. More is expected of the teacher then the pupil.

But for heaven sakes man, have a girl friend or even a wonderful marriage. Love them as God loves you.


Colter

[Gary cook]

Eph 5:25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

[freckle]

surrendersacrifice, on Nov 15 2009, 01:39 AM, said:

freckle, on Nov 11 2009, 06:38 PM, said:

But she's still divorced and cannot be reconciled with her former spouse. Maybe you last sentence should have read "a person who instigates a divorce" instead of " a divorced person"

If she did not divorce him; and does not remarry she is still faithful.

She's not faithful to him now! He's gone off and married another woman! I think she's free to re-marry if she wanted to - he broke the marriage.

[Naphal]

freckle, on Nov 15 2009, 07:52 AM, said:

surrendersacrifice, on Nov 15 2009, 01:39 AM, said:

freckle, on Nov 11 2009, 06:38 PM, said:

But she's still divorced and cannot be reconciled with her former spouse. Maybe you last sentence should have read "a person who instigates a divorce" instead of " a divorced person"

If she did not divorce him; and does not remarry she is still faithful.

She's not faithful to him now! He's gone off and married another woman! I think she's free to re-marry if she wanted to - he broke the marriage.

Amen. God divorced his wife after she committed adultery.

[IDF]

Naphal, on Feb 7 2010, 10:18 PM, said:

freckle, on Nov 15 2009, 07:52 AM, said:

surrendersacrifice, on Nov 15 2009, 01:39 AM, said:

freckle, on Nov 11 2009, 06:38 PM, said:

But she's still divorced and cannot be reconciled with her former spouse. Maybe you last sentence should have read "a person who instigates a divorce" instead of " a divorced person"

If she did not divorce him; and does not remarry she is still faithful.

She's not faithful to him now! He's gone off and married another woman! I think she's free to re-marry if she wanted to - he broke the marriage.

Amen. God divorced his wife after she committed adultery.

Now she's going to marry his Son with His blessing!

[Gary cook]

Colter, on Nov 15 2009, 01:05 PM, said:

Mercia2, on Nov 12 2009, 06:47 PM, said:

Colter, on Nov 11 2009, 09:40 PM, said:

I can say with a fair degree of confidence that when God joins things together, they don't come apart.

You cannot be married and be truly spiritual as you are always having to cater for fleshly things. It is just not my calling. Not until my work is done God willing. Then of course I would love to get married.

Mercia2,

God made us male and female for a reason. He gave us 1000 and 1 ways to enjoy life. Human relationships are a fundamental privilege and joy.

Spirituality does not mean becoming miserably prudish fanatics. One can most certainly be committed to a partner and committed to doing Gods will in that relationship and ALL other relationships. It's erroneous to think the two mutually exclusive.

One thing to bear in mind is the commingled requirements of apostleship and discipleship that are a part of the story of Jesus' establishment of the kingdom of heaven 2,000 years ago. Jesus didn't tell the 12 to divorce and abandon their families, his requirement for them was the unflinching commitment of the heart to the business of the kingdom. There could be no divided loyalties when it came to that then, nor can there be any in our faith life now. The 12 were a unique situtation. More is expected of the teacher then the pupil.

But for heaven sakes man, have a girl friend or even a wonderful marriage. Love them as God loves you.


Colter

2Co 3:6 Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

Gods made every one of HIS children ,ministers in some way or another ? God does not want us to be whore mongers!


Gal 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
Gal 5:20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
Gal 5:21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.


I know its hard to overcome these fleshly desires!

[Naphal]

IDF, on Feb 7 2010, 04:25 AM, said:

Now she's going to marry his Son with His blessing!

No, the son marries a new bride not the old divorced wife. Also it is an interesting sidenote that God had two wives who were sisters.

[orthotomeo]

While I agree with Ev that there is only one "unforgiveable sin", lets put it in its context. All forgiveness is based on repentance. Luke 17 is an example of this. God always expects repentance for forgiveness to be given. In the mean time he demonstrates grace.

[Asyncritus]

I was having a discussion with a very devout evangelical type who was just about to get remarried.

I naturally said: You know full well that scripture is very anti remarriage, don't you?

Yes, he said, I know it is.

So why are you doing this, said I. And he floored me with his answer.

Well, he said, scripture also says that it is better to marry than to burn. So I'm doing just that.



Any ideas about what my answer should have been? Because my brain seized up at that point. I hasten to say that my own position hasn't changed as a result of that encounter - but I still can't think of a serious riposte. All contributions welcome!

[Jeremy]

The passage he quoted from is talking about a choice between marrying and not marrying at all. It has nothing to do with divorce and remarriage.

[Naphal]

Jeremy, on 14 April 2010 - 06:05 PM, said:

The passage he quoted from is talking about a choice between marrying and not marrying at all. It has nothing to do with divorce and remarriage.

But it does include widows remarrying if they choose.


1 Corinthians 7:8 I say therefore to the unmarried and widows, It is good for them if they abide even as I.
1 Corinthians 7:9 But if they cannot contain, let them marry: for it is better to marry than to burn.

[Naphal]

A couple more related things:

Matthew 19:9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.


A man can remarry if the divorce was based on fornication.


Deuteronomy 24:1 When a man hath taken a wife, and married her, and it come to pass that she find no favour in his eyes, because he hath found some uncleanness in her: then let him write her a bill of divorcement, and give it in her hand, and send her out of his house.
Deuteronomy 24:2 And when she is departed out of his house, she may go and be another man's wife.

A woman can remarry after a divorce in this situation.

[Naphal]

Hudders, on 15 April 2010 - 12:08 AM, said:

Obviously widows are allowed to remarry, which makes me very much doubt that that is the situation that Asyncritus encountered.

I just was countering the claim that the bible is "anti remarriage" It is not.