34 replies to this topic

[RedShark]

People have different ideas and opinions about the purpose byt which God gave us many sciptures (including the bible), can we hear each and everyone's opinion on this matter so that we can see where we differ from each other?

[TrevorL]

Greetings RedShark,

RedShark, on Sep 20 2009, 03:28 AM, said:

People have different ideas and opinions about the purpose byt which God gave us many sciptures (including the bible), can we hear each and everyone's opinion on this matter so that we can see where we differ from each other?

One obvious purpose is that the Scriptures are able to make us wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus 2 Timothy 3:15. Apart from the Bible I do not know of any other fully reliable writings. What is your definition of "scriptures"?

Kind regards
Trevor

[RedShark]

TrevorL, on Sep 20 2009, 03:25 PM, said:

Greetings RedShark,

RedShark, on Sep 20 2009, 03:28 AM, said:

People have different ideas and opinions about the purpose byt which God gave us many sciptures (including the bible), can we hear each and everyone's opinion on this matter so that we can see where we differ from each other?

One obvious purpose is that the Scriptures are able to make us wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus 2 Timothy 3:15. Apart from the Bible I do not know of any other fully reliable writings. What is your definition of "scriptures"?

Kind regards
Trevor

May I know what do you mean by "through faith in Jesus Chirst," this is widely used in the world of Christianity? Scriptures are any written document about God available to men.

[TrevorL]

Greetings again RedShark,

RedShark, on Sep 20 2009, 11:35 AM, said:

TrevorL, on Sep 20 2009, 03:25 PM, said:

Greetings RedShark,

RedShark, on Sep 20 2009, 03:28 AM, said:

People have different ideas and opinions about the purpose byt which God gave us many sciptures (including the bible), can we hear each and everyone's opinion on this matter so that we can see where we differ from each other?

One obvious purpose is that the Scriptures are able to make us wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus 2 Timothy 3:15. Apart from the Bible I do not know of any other fully reliable writings. What is your definition of "scriptures"?

May I know what do you mean by "through faith in Jesus Chirst," this is widely used in the world of Christianity? Scriptures are any written document about God available to men.

Firstly, I was simply quoting 2 Timothy 3:15, but my understanding of through faith in Jesus Christ is the process of believing the glad tidings of the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ Acts 8:5,12. Philip preached these things and the Samaritans believed the things that he preached, and they were then baptised.

Your definition that the "Scriptures are any written document about God available to men" could be ambiguous. I have many books written about God, but some of them contain errors. I would prefer to define "The Scriptures" as the Bible, and treat all other books or writings with caution.

Kind regards
Trevor

[RedShark]

TrevorL, on Sep 20 2009, 07:21 PM, said:

Firstly, I was simply quoting 2 Timothy 3:15, but my understanding of through faith in Jesus Christ is the process of believing the glad tidings of the kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ Acts 8:5,12.

I am no American English speaking guy but it is not hard for me to understand the phrase "through faith in Jesus Christ," all because of the words themselves. Faith in Jesus is faith that emanates in Jesus and it is not a faith that emanates from how we do understand what we read. Jesus is not something that we read (especially the bible) because Jesus is real and alive and He is the Lord who created all things, including the bible that we read.

TrevorL, on Sep 20 2009, 07:21 PM, said:

Philip preached these things and the Samaritans believed the things that he preached, and they were then baptised.

That was then and the only means that you have to know that is through the bible and your understanding and comprehension, it is still different if applied to the phrase "through faith in Jesus.

TrevorL, on Sep 20 2009, 07:21 PM, said:

Your definition that the "Scriptures are any written document about God available to men" could be ambiguous. I have many books written about God, but some of them contain errors.

Come on TrevorL, how do you know they contain errors? What about the bible, does the bible contain no errors? If it does not (in your perception), how did you know? I am not distrusting the bible in this regards but just asking you how well you do know.

TrevorL, on Sep 20 2009, 07:21 PM, said:

I would prefer to define "The Scriptures" as the Bible, and treat all other books or writings with caution.

Kind regards
Trevor

May you see that definition of anything about faith, God, salvation, eternal life, etc. is still subjective and relative with respect to who is the speaker. This is also the cause of the proliferation of many religious sects all over the face of the globe.

[nsr]

Redshark, do we really need more than one thread discussing your views on whether the Bible text should be trusted? Could you please stick to your original thread without opening new ones on the same topic.

Thanks in advance

[RedShark]

nsr, on Sep 21 2009, 02:56 PM, said:

Redshark, do we really need more than one thread discussing your views on whether the Bible text should be trusted? Could you please stick to your original thread without opening new ones on the same topic.

Thanks in advance

The topic here is the sole purpose by which God gave us the bible and not whether the bible should be trusted or not.

[nsr]

Whatever it is, it looks to me like the same thing you're discussing in the other thread.

[RedShark]

nsr, on Sep 21 2009, 03:53 PM, said:

Whatever it is, it looks to me like the same thing you're discussing in the other thread.

To you....................., but it might not be to others.

Edited by RedShark, 21 September 2009 - 08:01 AM.

[daysha]

nsr, on Sep 21 2009, 08:53 AM, said:

Whatever it is, it looks to me like the same thing you're discussing in the other thread.

Agree.

[Huldah]

Redshark - we know why you don't trust the Bible. But why should we trust you?

[RedShark]

Huldah, on Sep 21 2009, 07:07 PM, said:

Redshark - we know why you don't trust the Bible. But why should we trust you?

Did I say you have to trust me? If there is anyone that you have to put all your trust, it is none other but the Lord God in the reality of His existence. It is Him whom you have to call on and come to and put all your trust. I am nothing and you don't have to come with me and the things I am sharing here with you are just testimonies to God that He is real and alive. Focus your attention to Him (God) so that you, too, may encounter God in the reality of His existence.

[Jeremy]

RedShark, on Sep 21 2009, 04:41 PM, said:

It is Him whom you have to call on and come to and put all your trust...He is real and alive. Focus your attention to Him (God) so that you, too, may encounter God in the reality of His existence.

We know all that from reading Scripture. What are you adding that we don't already know?

[RedShark]

Jeremy, on Sep 21 2009, 11:43 PM, said:

RedShark, on Sep 21 2009, 04:41 PM, said:

It is Him whom you have to call on and come to and put all your trust...He is real and alive. Focus your attention to Him (God) so that you, too, may encounter God in the reality of His existence.

We know all that from reading Scripture. What are you adding that we don't already know?

If you really know that, then it must have been long before that you have detached yourself from the claws and pangs of the bible which incarcerate your mind and put a limit to your comprenhension in knowing God. You seem not to know that when you truly come to Jesus in the reality of His existence, Jesus will respond to you literally and you will be surprised to know that He will be your personal Teacher who will lead you to all the truth. The Lord will definite inter-act with you should you come to Him the way Jesus wants you to, do you know that?

[Guido]

RedShark, on Sep 21 2009, 12:09 PM, said:

Jeremy, on Sep 21 2009, 11:43 PM, said:

RedShark, on Sep 21 2009, 04:41 PM, said:

It is Him whom you have to call on and come to and put all your trust...He is real and alive. Focus your attention to Him (God) so that you, too, may encounter God in the reality of His existence.

We know all that from reading Scripture. What are you adding that we don't already know?

If you really know that, then it must have been long before that you have detached yourself from the claws and pangs of the bible which incarcerate your mind and put a limit to your comprenhension in knowing God. You seem not to know that when you truly come to Jesus in the reality of His existence, Jesus will respond to you literally and you will be surprised to know that He will be your personal Teacher who will lead you to all the truth. The Lord will definite inter-act with you should you come to Him the way Jesus wants you to, do you know that?

So, if you believe that God reveals himself to people directly and instructs them directly, why then do you feel that you need to inform us? Don't you trust that God will inter-act with us directly without your help?

Edited by Guido, 21 September 2009 - 04:58 PM.

[Jeremy]

RedShark, on Sep 21 2009, 05:09 PM, said:

If you really know that, then it must have been long before that you have detached yourself from the claws and pangs of the bible which incarcerate your mind and put a limit to your comprenhension in knowing God. You seem not to know that when you truly come to Jesus in the reality of His existence, Jesus will respond to you literally and you will be surprised to know that He will be your personal Teacher who will lead you to all the truth. The Lord will definite inter-act with you should you come to Him the way Jesus wants you to, do you know that?

If you think you have some pressing information we need to know, then by all means share it with us - fire away, right now. Because for all these claims of additional revelation you make, I believe we have yet to see one scrap of information of any worth. It's nothing but words so far.

[RedShark]

Guido, on Sep 22 2009, 12:57 AM, said:

So, if you believe that God reveals himself to people directly and instructs them directly, why then do you feel that you need to inform us?

It is for that purpose why God commanded us to go to all nations and tongues - to inform that the Lord is the Teacher of all in reality and to share to you things that God gave us as His proof that He is the Lord so that you, too, may come to Him in the reality of His existence, plain and simple instruction that God asks of us to do unto our death.

Guido, on Sep 22 2009, 12:57 AM, said:

Don't you trust that God will inter-act with us directly without your help?

Yes, God will interact with anyone, and you yoursefl will have to come to God without my help. This is the only thing (telling everyone that God is the Teachers of all) that I have to do, but the decision to come or not to come to God in the reality of His existence is all yours, alone. You don't have to affiliate yourself with any religious organization for God to come in to your life.

[RedShark]

Jeremy, on Sep 22 2009, 04:56 AM, said:

If you think you have some pressing information we need to know, then by all means share it with us - fire away, right now. Because for all these claims of additional revelation you make, I believe we have yet to see one scrap of information of any worth. It's nothing but words so far.

Every thing with the Lord is based on free will (no pressing nor insistence) and the only thing that I have to emphasize with you is for you to know that the Lord God is the Teacher (not the bible nor men pastors of different religious orgnizations) of all hence there is really the need for all to come to Him in the reality of His existence. Wait for the Lord to respond to you after that you have come to Him so that you may know the things that the Lord will ask of you to do for the sake of your salvation and eternal life.

[RedShark]

Jeremy, on Sep 21 2009, 11:43 PM, said:

We know all that from reading Scripture. What are you adding that we don't already know?

Do you know that you have no life in the scriptures or even in the bible simply because it is not the Lord and same only testifies to us the reality of the existence of God?

[Richie]

RedShark, on Sep 21 2009, 06:46 PM, said:

Jeremy, on Sep 22 2009, 04:56 AM, said:

If you think you have some pressing information we need to know, then by all means share it with us - fire away, right now. Because for all these claims of additional revelation you make, I believe we have yet to see one scrap of information of any worth. It's nothing but words so far.

Every thing with the Lord is based on free will (no pressing nor insistence) and the only thing that I have to emphasize with you is for you to know that the Lord God is the Teacher (not the bible nor men pastors of different religious orgnizations) of all hence there is really the need for all to come to Him in the reality of His existence. Wait for the Lord to respond to you after that you have come to Him so that you may know the things that the Lord will ask of you to do for the sake of your salvation and eternal life.

We already know all that from reading the Bible.

Please tell us using Bible verses why you say these things. Otherwise it's completely pointless.

[Richie]

RedShark, on Sep 21 2009, 06:48 PM, said:

Jeremy, on Sep 21 2009, 11:43 PM, said:

We know all that from reading Scripture. What are you adding that we don't already know?

Do you know that you have no life in the scriptures or even in the bible simply because it is not the Lord and same only testifies to us the reality of the existence of God?

You are wrong. The Bible testifies of God and it's God speaking to us and telling us of the reality of his existence and what he wants us to do.

So you're totally wrong and everything you've said on this forum is utterly pointless.

[Guido]

RedShark, on Sep 21 2009, 10:39 PM, said:

Guido, on Sep 22 2009, 12:57 AM, said:

So, if you believe that God reveals himself to people directly and instructs them directly, why then do you feel that you need to inform us?

It is for that purpose why God commanded us to go to all nations and tongues - to inform that the Lord is the Teacher of all in reality and to share to you things that God gave us as His proof that He is the Lord so that you, too, may come to Him in the reality of His existence, plain and simple instruction that God asks of us to do unto our death.

What did God give you as His proof?

Quote

Guido, on Sep 22 2009, 12:57 AM, said:

Don't you trust that God will inter-act with us directly without your help?

Yes, God will interact with anyone, and you yoursefl will have to come to God without my help. This is the only thing (telling everyone that God is the Teachers of all) that I have to do....

Okay, so you've told us that. If that's all you have to say, then why are you still here?

[RedShark]

Richie, on Sep 22 2009, 10:57 AM, said:

Please tell us using Bible verses why you say these things. Otherwise it's completely pointless.

The bible is not the Lord God hence why the need to base what I'm saying on it when it is from God himself that I received those things that I share with you in this forum? If you look on at those as pointless, then I'm done with you and may you be saved by what you're saying.

[RedShark]

Guido, on Sep 22 2009, 11:23 AM, said:

What did God give you as His proof?

Many things like too many clouds and ring of fire that encircled us when the Lord sent us the HS during the gathering that God commanded us to do in one of the town outside the metropolis, long message about what and how is the Lord in the reality of His existence, miracles like healing instantly a broken finger (swollen and grayish in color), causing the child to walk afloat in the air, reading in front of many what were exactly on our mind during one of our gathering and many other things.

Guido, on Sep 22 2009, 11:23 AM, said:

Okay, so you've told us that. If that's all you have to say, then why are you still here?

Yes, that is the climax of the story. Still here just to talk to you of other things based on your response/s.

[RedShark]

Richie, on Sep 22 2009, 10:58 AM, said:

You are wrong. The Bible testifies of God and it's God speaking to us and telling us of the reality of his existence and what he wants us to do.

What is the matter with you Richie, the Lord God is the Living God and He has His own mouth to speak to us and tell us how He does really exist and live in His own ways, why assume that God is the bible that speaks to us about the reality of the existence of God when same (bible) has no life in itself that it cannot talk to anyone? God is real and alive, Richie, and He is not the bible.

Richie, on Sep 22 2009, 10:58 AM, said:

So you're totally wrong and everything you've said on this forum is utterly pointless.

That is your subjective perception about the bible and about God, but that does not mean it is the truth simply because you are not God, Richie.

[Richie]

RedShark, on Sep 21 2009, 09:06 PM, said:

Richie, on Sep 22 2009, 10:58 AM, said:

You are wrong. The Bible testifies of God and it's God speaking to us and telling us of the reality of his existence and what he wants us to do.

What is the matter with you Richie,

Nothing is the matter with me. Except I can't sleep and now I am wasting my time talking to a false prophet (you, talking about Godlical nonsense).

Quote

the Lord God is the Living God and He has His own mouth to speak to us and tell us how He does really exist and live in His own ways,

Yes I know that and he speaks to us through the Bible.

Quote

why assume that God is the bible

I don't believe God is the Bible. I believe God is God and the Bible is the Bible.

Quote

that speaks to us about the reality of the existence of God when same (bible) has no life in itself that it cannot talk to anyone? God is real and alive, Richie, and He is not the bible.

Well obviously God is real and alive and he is not the Bible. But he speaks to us through the Bible. Not through anything Godlical. Godlical = nonsense.

Are you taking drugs?

[Guido]

RedShark, on Sep 22 2009, 12:00 AM, said:

Guido, on Sep 22 2009, 11:23 AM, said:

What did God give you as His proof?

Many things like too many clouds and ring of fire that encircled us when the Lord sent us the HS during the gathering that God commanded us to do in one of the town outside the metropolis, long message about what and how is the Lord in the reality of His existence, miracles like healing instantly a broken finger (swollen and grayish in color), causing the child to walk afloat in the air, reading in front of many what were exactly on our mind during one of our gathering and many other things.

I see. Well, that would be pretty convincing for those people, but not so much for us here on BTDF because we weren't at the gathering of which you speak.

If God should ever choose to speak to me directly, then I'm quite happy to listen. Until then, I'll take what I can get in the Bible. Is that pretty much what you were trying to tell us, or is there something else we would need to do in order to get the conversation with God started?

[Jeremy]

RedShark, on Sep 22 2009, 05:00 AM, said:

Many things like too many clouds and ring of fire that encircled us when the Lord sent us the HS during the gathering that God commanded us to do in one of the town outside the metropolis, long message about what and how is the Lord in the reality of His existence, miracles like healing instantly a broken finger (swollen and grayish in color), causing the child to walk afloat in the air, reading in front of many what were exactly on our mind during one of our gathering and many other things.

RedShark, I refer you to the Forum Guidelines which say, inter alia:

Quote

2.6 This forum exists for the purpose of constructive, thoughtful, and informed discussion. It is not a platform for advertising, airing personal grievances and grudges, making public attacks, or promoting idiosyncratic beliefs, especially to the detriment of the broader discussion or the derailment of a thread. Posts containing such material will be subject to potential deletion, regardless of their other content or merits.

This is an official warning. BTDF is for the discussion of the Bible. If you want to discuss something else, kindly go and find an alternative outlet - we don't want to hear any more of this, thank you.

[RedShark]

Richie, on Sep 22 2009, 01:20 PM, said:

Nothing is the matter with me. Except I can't sleep and now I am wasting my time talking to a false prophet (you, talking about Godlical nonsense).

Yes I know that and he speaks to us through the Bible.

I don't believe God is the Bible. I believe God is God and the Bible is the Bible.

Well obviously God is real and alive and he is not the Bible. But he speaks to us through the Bible. Not through anything Godlical. Godlical = nonsense.

Are you taking drugs?

I am a plain follower of the Lord Jesus Christ in the reality of His existence, not a false prophet as you accused me of.

You know God is real and alive and that He is not the bible, what hampers you in believing God is still speaking today to mankind via His own way? Why do you have to confine God in the bible wrt His dealing with mankind considering He (God) can speak on His own at any time? Can't God talk to anyone without the bible?

If you believe God is God and the bible is the bible, then deal seperately with the Lord God and with that of the bible. Do not put God in a box saying God speaks to us through the bible, how do you know when you acknowledge God is real and alive, have you spoken to God?

[RedShark]

Guido, on Sep 22 2009, 08:43 PM, said:

Is that pretty much what you were trying to tell us, or is there something else we would need to do in order to get the conversation with God started?

That's it, just come to God as if you were a little child who doesn't yet know the good and the evil, and learn to wait for God's response, be sure not to overtake God.